This is just that last of many cases of MS Outlook acting in an intentional power abusive market distorting way.

I do not know about tutanota and if they are a bad actor in the email space. But I remember them having done funny things like banning the complete German Hetzner IP range because Hetzner didn't want to give them customers information without an curt order (which I guess Hetzner isn't allowed to do either iff the customer(s) in question is a private customer...).

Like consider Google banning all Azure hosted mail providers independent of their reputation and DMARK,DKIM,SPF etc. because MS keeps with the law and doesn't give Google private customer information, it's that ridiculous.

My private email server gets completly blocked on regular bases. They are blocking the whole ip-range of my provider. You get no response from them whatsoever. You have to fill out a form und wait a couple of days. You can however sign up for a 200$ whitelist... from a different company owned by guess who.

Maybe Tutanota.com has a lot of outlook users reporting your marketing emails as spam. I generally do this if the unsubscribe route is too painful, or even if it takes too long to load.

I wouldn't mind these providers being aggressive with spam filtering IF they would just bounce the messages so i know WHY. I've had so many cases where an 'email wasn't sent' by our systems and then the logs show it was accepted by outlook.com for delivery, but never even showed up in the spam folder (apparently, if customers are to be trusted).

Many providers seems to do this, respond everything ok and then drop the message silently..

This sort of email oligopoly/mafia problem can only really be solved with legislation. There needs to be push from within the EU to legislate this hopeless situation.

To be fair, Hotmail / Outlook is known to be the worst of the worst when it comes to accepting emails.

Even a spotlessly configured MTA will not guarantee you anything.

Hey, mailcow founder here!

That’s one of the reasons I stopped working on hosted mail. It has not turned to anything better with big companies putting their hands over it. It’s more controlled now but the same crap as before, just as dangerous and a bit more expensive.

Currently working on a system with as much control as possible but piggybacking existing providers' transports.

I have an outlook.com account, too and having a look at the Spam-folder is as important as looking at the Inbox. Too many important mails get missing with outlook

Looking at the correspondence cited in the article I expect this is because the "AI"-powered anti-spam detection is hallucinating, and have decided every email from this provider is spam, based on a few (or many as the case may be) bad apples.

Hah! My bank did this too before I went on a trip - it blocks Interac transfer requests from Wise, and will hold your outgoing transfers until you call to validate, calling it fraud. Gotta love using your own anti-abuse processes to stifle competition, as little impact as it may have.

Recently, I managed to get my personal mail server working and delivering to Outlook.

Of all the major mail providers, I found getting my mails to Outlook the hardest. Gmail played nice once I setup DKIM, DMARC, SPF, MTA-STS, rDNS and a couple more things that I forgot setup exactly the way they like it.

Outlook was harder though. I had to send a series of mails spread over multiple days to people who had Outlook accounts and get them to both mark it as not spam and reply to the mail until it eventually started working.

It's been a couple of months, not sure if it still works though. Hope it does.

I'd be pissed off if I were an Outlook user - it's a shame that big tech get treated as the "gold standard" - I get that spam prevention is important but it shouldn't hurt your business. Their support is below standards. I wonder how many opportunities Outlook businesses lose because they don't receive certain emails.

That being said, email as a whole could do with being replaced with a more robust solution to make it more versatile and offer other spam prevention techniques.

Little OT, I was using Hotmail in 2015 to apply to grad schools. I got an email about interview from a professor with @vt.edu address that got flagged into spam. I noticed only after someone else got selected for funding. To this day I don’t understand why an email written by a professor from a reputable university domain was flagged as spam, but I have definitely stopped using Hotmail

If you give people free web services they're going to use it for spam, porn, file sharing or crypto mining. If even their most basic tier only cost a few quid a year, it would probably stop spam usage by 99%

most of the phishing emails bypassing my spam filters (on Fastmail) recently have been from prod.outlook.com

it's almost impossible to figure out where to report spam; most of their support articles are about how you report spam in Outlook instead. For reference, those reporting emails are:

phish@office365.microsoft.com

junk@office365.microsoft.com

but you get zero feedback, and I keep getting repeat phishing too

they care so little about cleaning up their own act, i'm considering just rejecting their stuff with a bounce message. i checked, and there's very little important traffic from prod.outlook.com arriving in my inbox.

MS outlook.com also blocks emails from apple.com as spam

What's worse - often times emails sent out from an old hotmail/outlook.com account always end up in recipient's junk/spam folder. They still haven't addressed [this](https://x.com/tvjames/status/1278813439222145024?s=20), it seems, even to this very day.

So what fraction of send mail do the actual end receivers consider spam? And why would there not be some reasonable threshold. Or should we entirely instead ban spam filtering?

Good. That's half way to my ideal way to deal with email.

1. Emails from everyone (including you) go into the spam folder. 2. I identify senders I do actually want to receive messages from.

The industry isn't doing item 2 very well, but default-deny for new senders is exactly what I want from a mailbox service.

With most spam coming from Outlook accounts I'd say they should first start fixing spam problem at their own end.

anti competitive!

Mimecast for Outlook is blocking (reporting as phishing...) Jira notifications from one specific coworker and I can't turn it off.

I hate everything about M$ so damn much.

Microsoft is real good at prioritizing blatant spam emails to in my inbox and constantly moving to junk or never receiving important and legit emails.

Microsoft may be using AI for spam detection and... is - of course - unable to fix it, because you can not debug a neural network (or may need months/years to debug and fix it)... So: WELCOME TO THE NEW WONDERFUL WORLD OF AI where we will not be able to fix things...

GMail also blocks mails from google.com as spam. :P I needed to add a special filter to not move those mails to spam.

Another German email provider, GMX seems to have the same issue at the moment too.

Seznam.cz blocked all emails contained links from OneDrive recently.

maybe it is because of the leak made in Ontario Superior Court by a former RCMP official about Tuta helping intelligence agencies

I'd be surprised. I don't think Microsoft has ever abused its power.

didnt know tutanota even existed, they just got a new sign up from me tho.