• by spenrose on 6/10/2022, 2:54:49 PM

    "Over the years, the heat from the trains soaked into the clay to the point where it can no longer absorb any more heat. Tunnels that were a mere 14 degrees Celsius in the 1900s can now have air temperatures as high as 30 degrees Celsius on parts of the tube network."

  • by aaaaaaaaaaab on 6/10/2022, 3:44:30 PM

    Regenerative braking would improve a lot with not just the heat issue, but also air quality. Commuters on the London Underground get a characteristic grey/black snot from the brake dust they inhale. If you stare into the tunnel after a train left you can literally see a haze of brake dust in the air.

  • by giomasce on 6/10/2022, 5:09:17 PM

    I love this complex-engineering-thing-you-thought-it-was-trivial-but-it-doesn't-even-try-to-be kind of articles!

  • by ClumsyPilot on 6/11/2022, 2:01:18 AM

    > The difficulty of adding more ventilation is the lack of space above ground to put new ventilation shafts. This is always going to be a problem for the older tube tunnels except on rare occasions when a surface development takes place at just the right location and agreements can be made to include a shaft down to the Underground

    Sounds like we need to knock down a few houses. This isn't unreasonable for critical infrastructure.

    Also sounds like giving people free ground source heat pumps along the tube line would be best - they would be pumping out the heat thats in the clay. The article talk about a scheme, but this needs to be done at scale

  • by interestica on 6/10/2022, 5:43:14 PM

    I think the Montreal metro faces a lot of these same issues. It works out in the winter where you don't need to actively heat the space. In the summer, it can be unbearable. I'm not sure if the type of rolling stock (rubber tires + tunnel track) has a major difference from other typical subway cars.

  • by tomohawk on 6/10/2022, 9:46:22 PM

    If they added hydraulic hybrid braking to the trains, they could capture 80% or more of the kinetic energy and reuse it to accelerate again. This would drastically cut down on heat. By way of comparison, electric batteries can capture maybe 20-25% of the kinetic energy.

    Uncaptured energy is likely turned into pure heat.

  • by cogman10 on 6/10/2022, 9:49:54 PM

    Makes me wonder if we can do something more productive with the heat.

    They mention energy generation, but what about heat pumps and water heaters for the above ground buildings? Probably cost prohibitive, but wouldn't it be neat if the waste heat from the brakes ended warming a building or hot water heater?

  • by christkv on 6/10/2022, 7:21:45 PM

    Could using magnets to break and start be a solution to reduce the heat generation ?

  • by londons_explore on 6/10/2022, 5:23:56 PM

    The main cause of heat is the inefficiency of the trains. All the brake energy is converted to heat. The motors and controllers are pretty inefficient too - modern electric motors+controllers are 95-98% efficient, whereas most tube trains are more like 40-60% efficient. For example, to go slowly, they simply put a big resistor in the circuit and waste 50+% of the energy!!

    Perhaps not coincidentally, the inefficiency also has a massive carbon and budget impact... Or it would, if the train system had to pay for the electricity it used - which it doesn't! Trains in the UK are given free unmetered electricity, so there is no reason to conserve energy. Hot tunnels are just an extreme symptom of that.

    If they had to pay for usage, at todays wholesale electricity rates, it would cost nearly a billion pounds a year. Which is ~20% of their revenue! I can see why they don't want to pay that bill!